From the Creativity at Work Newsletter, December 2001
Weaving Together Community, Care
and Knowledge Management
at the World Bank
Linda Naiman interviews Seth Kahan at the World Bank
Seth Kahan has found a unique way to weave together his passions for storytelling and the ancient spirit of community gathering, with leadership and knowledge management, at the World Bank, Washington D.C..
Fascinated by his capacity for visionary work within the confines of an unlikely bureaucracy, I interviewed Seth to find out how he integrates seemingly diametric disciplines within the context of innovation and knowledge management.
LN: What is Knowledge Management?
SK: Knowledge Management (KM) is about getting the right knowledge to the right location where it can be applied when it’s needed; which is hard to do. It involves creating an ecology of networks, channels, so knowledge can flow to where it is needed. Knowledge is an emergent property that arises when relevant experience and application meet. An example of an emergent property is the "wetness" of water. Hydrogen is one element, oxygen is another; neither is "wet" until they are combined. This quality is a new level of being.
Knowledge emerges as we apply experience. The potential of knowledge emergence increases through building relationships among people. Sometimes knowledge is explicit, as when it can be recorded in a document. Other times, it defies being expressed. Tacit knowledge is an example of one kind that cannot be expressed or captured. Yet, it can be used. By increasing the quality of our interactions and relationships we make it more available.
LN: It is my understanding that creativity turns raw data into knowledge. Raw data is meaningless unless you can apply it to something, and it takes creativity to find meaning, to find the relationship that turns information into knowledge. Do you agree with that? What do you see as the relationship between KM, creativity and innovation?
SK: I would agree. I think that knowledge and creativity are both expressions of the "life force." It’s like chi at a fundamental level. Knowledge can be likened to the unfolding of a seed; it is a core process through which people find meaning.
LN: Knowledge in that sense is one of the aspects of the Holy Grail for organizations.
SK: Business now has to rely on innovation to stay ahead of trends. The quality of innovation in an organization is impacted by the quality of knowledge they are able to develop.The quality of knowledge development is increased by the degree of caring that takes place in a social environment. Ikujiro Nonaka, et al , write about this in the recent book, Knowledge Emergence (Oxford University Press, 2001). In high-care organizations people tend to talk about things they are passionate about, including their reason for work: the mission of the organization.
Nonaka draws a line to connect the amount of care in the environment and the quality of knowledge developed. In most organizations this awareness is missing today. I think people see caring as a nice-to-have, but they don’t really understand it actually impacts the bottom line. When there is a problem, people revert to things they know will make a profit and often will drop the caring. Yet, if caring is a contributor to the quality of Knowledge, then it is most needed in times of crisis. It’s even more important to keep the caring present.
Nonaka breaks care into five components:
1. A genuine propensity to help.
2. Time and space for people to connect with each other.
3. Proactive inquiry; both emotional and factual.
Factor in time at meetings to share with each other at a human level emotionally, before going into the business at hand. I have led teams in which I’ve been explicit about this. I’ve learned that when a group takes the time do deal with emotional issues that came up and clear the air of "surfaced unmentionables,’ logistics flow smoothly and we move into higher performance.
In 1996, while building the first knowledge management system at the bank, the Subject Matter Experts (SMEs) and the tech people hit a log jam because they did not understand each other’s needs. I was designated to break the log jam by management.
At my first session I brought a picture of my son, who was three months old at the time, and a replica of an Egyptian deity holding two worlds. I held up the picture of my son and said, "I’m here because I know we are creating the world he is going to inherit. This is what gets me up in the morning. The World Bank has a mission in which it addresses many of the core issues of the world today, and makes a difference. I feel deeply connected to our mission."
Then, I held up the replica: a king on bowed knees holding the two worlds. I shared that this was an ancient symbol of balancing multiple worlds. In our case we had to bridge the two worlds of content and technology. They could just as easily have been politics and mission, or the spiritual and the mundane. I asked everyone to consider how they could hold both worlds, not letting go of either. I encouraged them to consider doing an excellent job of both delivering the content and developing the technology. The energy [of the group] shifted.
The two symbols I used were personally meaningful to me and became touch points for the group. We moved to a higher level as collaborators because the caring component became explicit.
4. Tolerance for apparently intolerable behaviour.
For example, if someone shows up at a meeting in shorts and tee shirt when a suit and tie are expected. If there is tolerance, we don’t just write them off. We ask them what’s going on. Did they not get the message? We assume they have a good reason in their mind for their behavior. This is an absolutely critical perspective in today’s diverse workplace.
5. Being explicit that care is part of the value system and is expected in the workplace.
LN: What was the impact of September 11 relative to caring at the bank?
SK: After September 11, there was an outpouring of humanity at the bank; people expressed more care with each other. This was an opportunity for people to either rise to the occasion or become less available in their relationships. Remarkably there was a sea-change in the organization as managers and staff alike expressed their concern for each other’s well-being. It continues today. It is beautiful to witness.
LN: Are the dimensions of care which you have identified, consciously practised at the bank, or is this something you bring to the table?
SK: I’m aware that I bring this to the table, but I’m not alone. The bank is such a large organization. The president has demonstrated his caring on an ongoing basis for several years; he has been articulate about it. I see more and more of that spirit rising and coming to the foreground. Yet, it is still an organization in transition.
The Bank is not alone in this regard; many organizations are going through the shift from a mechanical model to a life-giving one. The Bank is working very hard, and consciously. The shift can be seen in its priorities from how it now approaches its clients to new HR policies. They all emphasize a comprehensive, inclusive and non-linear approach. It’s quite heartening.
LN: Can you speak about creativity with respect to care?
SK: I think creativity is fundamental and part of the same ecosystem. I always come back to the family as a metaphor. As growing human beings—adults and children—caring and creativity are fundamental. I’m not sure you can truly have one without the other.
LN: So when people have a high degree of care in an organization, the ‘stuff’ they talk about is at a higher level. Therefore caring actually increases the quality of knowledge and that quality of knowledge impacts the quality of innovation. Or the quality of innovation is impacted by caring.
SK: Absolutely. One of the things that’s fundamental about knowledge sharing is that it’s done on a voluntary basis. It can’t be conscripted. Dave Snowden talks about this. He has asked, "what is the difference between a volunteer army and a conscripted army?"
LN: Passion?
SK: Exactly. The behavior each translates into is hugely different. Conscripted soldiers will do the least amount they have to and try to remain as safe as possible whereas the volunteer army wants to fight for their cause. They are ready to go.
LN: Passion!
SK: Yes, passion. A conscripted army sensing defeat will take off; whereas a volunteer army will choose to fight to the end. Let’s apply the metaphor of generativity to this idea. If you are doing something you truly believe in, say for example, raising a child, you will give everything to it, even to the point of your own self sacrifice. You will do remarkable things no one would consider doing if conscripted.
When we talk about creativity in business and KM, we see the need for having that kind of passion. The question is, how do we do that? You can’t make people have passion. But, you can create an environment where people can choose to engage in what they are passionate about.
LN: You also need a mission, a guiding vision and purpose…
SK: That people want to be part of. And "selling more cars" ain’t gonna do it!
LN: At the World Bank, the noble idea is eradicating poverty in the world. I could see a lot of people being motivated to do that. Of course the extent to which you’ve actually helped or hindered is another story...
SK: It’s a very complex story too, and that’s good because that is what life is about.
LN: How do your bridge your role as artist/storyteller with KM?
SK: From my background in experimental theater I became interested in basic human behavior. I sought out and participated in ceremonies in the wilderness. What I experienced was something really unique.Keep in mind, this is not an indigenous experience. I sought out people who specialized in translating these experiences so that they are relevant to people today.
Participants would come through an ordeal that pushed them to their limits. They had stories to tell about how they survived the ordeal and what they learned in the process. The ‘elders,’ people who had been through the ordeal many times and were guardians of the ritual process, would listen to the stories. The elders would help to deconstruct them stories, looking together with the participants for treasures that would benefit the larger community. When they found them, they would weave the treasures from the stories into the story of the ceremony and share the story with others.
I could see applying this process to KM. Imagine going to a KM council and telling them your story, your truth from deep within your being. You tell them, I learned this, I learned that. The response might be, this story you told about such-and-such is really not so valuable to us. But, that story you told about this-and-this is really incredible. We haven’t heard that before and it could really make a difference to our people. Let’s unfold it together.
This "unfoldng" is a co-creative process between you and the ‘elder.’ The ‘elder’ then weaves your story into the fabric of the community. You are elevated to contributor status the next time there is a ritual and you get to help someone else through this same process. We don’t have these processes in organizations.
LN: Do you do that?
SK: I am working on this now in several settings.
LN: This is what therapists of the shamanic ilk do.
SK: That’s right.
LN: When they induce you to go into a trance, that is exactly what happens.
SK: When David Bohm was dying, his friend Joe Jaworski asked him what does humanity have to do to get make the next quantum level jump as a species. He said, "We need to learn to think together. We have not mastered that. We are still thinking as individuals." The process I’ve been talking about is one of the ways to create a community of thinkers who conscientiously try to build a social fabric that will be part of our children’s world.
LN: Yes, I like that metaphor. How did you get permission to tell your stories and create rituals at the World Bank?
SK: Well, it wasn’t overt. I participated in a vision quest in the early 90s and saw my work in ritual and storytelling, my love for the earth and my work at the World Bank come together. I created a performance piece called "Voices of the Earth" which I performed for five years; four times at the Bank on Earth Day. People got to know me as a storyteller and I was asked to tell stories in a wide variety of situations — sometimes to build community within business units. It started on the periphery.
When I began working with Stephen Denning, I started to share my ideas and my learning experiences for participating in and designing rituals. He encouraged me to try some of these ideas out in formal settings. We never talked about them overtly as being ceremonies. We just took what seemed applicable from the designs and incorporated them into business gatherings and checked to see what results we got. Soon, I was asked to be part of major retreats in the organization because of my reputation for creating a certain kind of experience.
LN: So you are a grass roots innovator.
SK: Yes. Now I’m explicitly asked to do my storytelling, but it did start from grassroots.
LN: What advice can you give to people in organizations who want to innovate and create change? What advice can you give about using storytelling to inspire change?
SK: The best thing I know about creating change is to "be" the change; to embody it in as many aspects as you can, rather than telling people about it. Let yourself resolve the tension between your ideals and what the environment is ready to embrace.
LN: What is the power of the story? It moves people beyond the ordinary.
SK: There is a great book written by Denning called The Springboard: How Storytelling Ignites Action in Knowledge-Era Organizations (Butterworth Heinemann, 2000). If you really want to move people when you are telling a story, you need to locate that energy within yourself. If there is something in the story that is profound to you, you need to be able to re-visit the wonder of that profundity when you tell the story. That’s what people will resonate to. Consider yourself a tuning fork.
LN: Beautifully said. I love the metaphor of the tuning fork. Do you have any closing thoughts to share with my readers?
SK: What strikes me about organizations is the notion that we are locked into a certain way of doing things and we have to run interference to make change happen. I think that is fundamentally flawed. I think that we are actively creating the world through out thought processes. We imagine the world, then we build it, inhabit it and relate to it. I see people as being so much more powerful then they give themselves credit for being. I think the questions you are asking about creativity and knowledge point us in that direction. Point us towards our power.
I remember when I came out of my vision quest, many of the participants remarked, "This vision quest changed my life." My take was different: my life was changing so I participated in the vision quest. This perspective shifts the power from an external event, the quest, back to me. We deserve to have that perspective in the workplace. We deserve to have work that is fulfilling, that generates wealth, and makes a contribution to society and the world. The source for that is not outside of us, it’s inside.
LN: Thank you Seth!
Seth Kahan is a contributor to our book Orchestrating Collaboration at Work.
Seth Weaver Kahan served with the Knowledge Management (KM) program office as a key member of the team responsible for developing and implementing the World Bank’s KM initiative, under the direction of Steve Denning.
Happy creating,
Linda Naiman
